Royce Manual Help Please

[whiskychaser]

I don't know if you all on that side of the pond got an animated show called "king of the hill" written by the same people that did beavis and butthead. Buck Strickland occasionally calls Hank Hill "old top" to imply that he's barking up the wrong tree/worrying excessively &c. I'm not sure what exactly it means.

Used to enjoy King of the Hill but never knew anybody else that watched it. Perhaps why I havent seen it for a while. Shame

[93 525 Paul]

Used to enjoy King of the Hill but never knew anybody else that watched it. Perhaps why I havent seen it for a while. Shame

That is a shame, that's some of the best TV in existence.

Hey, what have folks done for sourcing the tools? Looks like at minimum I need the cam holder, the chain tensioning tool and the Torx head bolt tool. (Ever since I was a devoted BavAuto client and learned of AutohausAZ and BMA, I always ask...)
On a medium/high mileage engine like mine, what should the job include other than R&R with a HG set and new H bolts? Guessing resurfacing, valve job, guides, etc? Anybody had success with the pelican method of cam removal?

[whiskychaser]

Anybody had success with the pelican method of cam removal?

I used that method and it worked very well. While I did the job alone its probably best to have a mate hold the cam to stop it twisting. This is particularly important when putting the cam back in - the first nut wont even start to thread until you twist the cam a tiny bit off the 'sweet spot'. Hopefully the valves/guides/seats are in good shape and you wont have to bother taking the cams out

PS. If you do go ahead, can I suggest you get your HG from a dealer or from the shop that skims your head if you are having it done

[Dave M]

That is a shame, that's some of the best TV in existence.

Hey, what have folks done for sourcing the tools? Looks like at minimum I need the cam holder, the chain tensioning tool and the Torx head bolt tool. (Ever since I was a devoted BavAuto client and learned of AutohausAZ and BMA, I always ask...)
On a medium/high mileage engine like mine, what should the job include other than R&R with a HG set and new H bolts? Guessing resurfacing, valve job, guides, etc? Anybody had success with the pelican method of cam removal?

We've discussed M50 head removal witout any 'special' tools many times in the past. Try a search and you should find methods to do the head gasket using nothing but a good straight edge for cam alignment, a safety pin or equivalent for secondary chain tensioner and a regular torx ground down to fit the one or bolts that are hard to get at near the timing cover.

If you have any trouble or any more questions, pm me.

Dave

[93 525 Paul]

We've discussed M50 head removal witout any 'special' tools many times in the past. Try a search and you should find methods to do the head gasket using nothing but a good straight edge for cam alignment, a safety pin or equivalent for secondary chain tensioner and a regular torx ground down to fit the one or bolts that are hard to get at near the timing cover.

If you have any trouble or any more questions, pm me.

Dave

Found it, never saw it in my (many) previous searches. Others may appreciate a shortcut...
http://www.bimmernut.com/forum/showt...M50+head+tools

[93 525 Paul]

Thanks for the help fellas.
Between and amongst flu, bronchitis and business travel I have the head ready to pull. Quite a chore, had to buy the female torx sockets, turned the socket's OD on my lathe to get to all the head bolts.
The only hiccup so far (well, other than misplacing my 3/8" drive 10mm deep socket - WTF???) has been trying to remove the Vanos device. It would come about 1/2" forward but then stop. It felt like there was a hard stop, it wouldn't budge. Finally loosened the nuts on the one cam gear and the bolts on the other and with those broken loose it came clear as easy as could be. My guess is that the intake gear was bound up and wouldn't rotate far enough to let the Vanos splines disengage.
With all this rain I'm going to have to push it in the garage to make any progress.
Wish me luck. Thanks again.

[whiskychaser]

Its all been said before but maybe worth repeating:
That head is heavy. Get a mate to help or maybe use a lift. When you break the 'seal' on the HG and clear the lugs, the head may try to slide across the surface of the block as its at an angle. It has to come straight up to avoid snapping off the chain guide or catching a valve. Unless you have the bonnet off, the head obviously has to come out one side. So work out who is going hold it while the other runs round to help When putting it back on, I'd suggest a couple of pieces of wood between the head and block till you get it in the right position. Best of luck with it!

[93 525 Paul]

Its all been said before but maybe worth repeating:
That head is heavy. Get a mate to help or maybe use a lift. When you break the 'seal' on the HG and clear the lugs, the head may try to slide across the surface of the block as its at an angle. It has to come straight up to avoid snapping off the chain guide or catching a valve. Unless you have the bonnet off, the head obviously has to come out one side. So work out who is going hold it while the other runs round to help When putting it back on, I'd suggest a couple of pieces of wood between the head and block till you get it in the right position. Best of luck with it!

Thanks for the advice. I lift weights and can curl way more than the head weighs, so I was going to make the mistake of doing it solo. With the reminder on the deck angle and the valve and chain guide risk, I definitely won't.

[93 525 Paul]

Best of luck with it!

I got her off safely using an electric winch mounted overhead. Super easy. (Yes, as you suspect, I have no friends.)
I can upload a photo if you want, but I was surprised how good the block deck, the gasket and the head looked. It is not obvious without close inspection what happened.
It looks to me like the hg and the head remained sealed and that a very small area of the gasket in the metal cylinder sealing ring area between cylinders 4/5 and 5/6 looks cleaned and the surface of the block there looks superficially soda blasted. I am guessing the block and gasket lost seal there and cylinder pressures were lost.
Much more slight than I would have expected. I wanted an "aha"...

Any input? Opining and guessing welcome.

[93 525 Paul]

You might find this useful:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/BMW/tech...ead-Gasket.htm

Took the head to a machine shop, guy said the surface wasn't clean enough to check for flat. He did a test run and said it might be OK. Took it home and cleaned it up. Decided to go ahead and yank the cams to make the cleanup and checking easier.
Used the Pelican method to remove the cams last night, worked like a charm.

The while we are at it question looms. What would you refresh/replace while you have the head off a 178k mile engine?