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View Full Version : Just because it's car related... my track day at Buttonwillow 8/11/06



TC535i
08-13-2006, 11:06 PM
I drove my '92 318is for this... bought the car for $2600, it's been a fun project. :)



Everything showed up like it was supposed to by Thursday night, thank god. Installed the coilovers in the parking lot at work on Friday, and had time to shower before getting to my 4pm alignment appointment. Had the car set up to my specs... wanted whatever camber I got in the front (non-adjustable), and about .5 degree less negative in the back. Slight bit of toe in up front, and a little more in the rear. Took it to Stokes Tire in Santa Monica, and the tech John Jr. took care of me. After a little confusion after I got back when he was just finishing (he had me slightly toed out up front, I wanted a little in), we finalized on some numbers, I got a printout, and drove away happy. With the coilovers set about halfway down in front and full low in back (not all that low on 600lb springs), I did -3 degrees camber on each front wheel with just a touch of toe in, and -2.5 degrees camber out back with a little more toe. Great guys, owner races, they'll take care of you just how you want.


Buttonwillow Saturday was a goddamn blast. Even tho my brakes were totally cooked, I was still able to drive it reasonably hard and get to know the new suspension setup. I tried running firmer adjustments on the shocks up front, but that ended up giving me some oversteer exiting sharp corners. Set em both to around 1/2 firm, and it felt pretty good... need to dial out the sway bars tho, a little softer in the rear I think.


I was talking to a guy with an E46... this thing was crazy. 240whp supercharged/intercooled 325, gutted interior, welded roll cage, full-on touchscreen data aquisition. This thing told him how fast he was going in each turn, all sorts of info. Phenominal setup, the guy was an engineer, did it all himself. Take a look at his website... especially read the entry for Aug 11/12 at Buttonwillow.

http://www.vsengineeringtrack.com

Anyhow, I heard the organizers were lending out lap timers, and I'd never really known what kind of times I was running, so I asked to borrow one and he helped me set it up. Ran it on my session around noon or so. Afterwards, I couldn't figure out how to get it to read back times, so I went to ask him. He pulls up my lap times and starts flipping thru them... best one I pulled was a 2:21.69 or so. I asked him how that compared to the faster cars, and he looked confused. Turns out the best time he ran out there all day was a 2:20.241. I guess the free-eighteen held its own alright! :D


I was pretty much neck and neck with a yellow Elise. If I let him by, he couldn't get past me... if he let me by, I couldn't pull from him. Turns out those things are about the same hp I'm putting down (he had maybe 5-10 more, probably even more as my s/c heatsoked), and weigh 1000 lbs less. He thought my car was an M3, he had the best look on his face when he found out I was actually making less power than him.


All in all a great day, save a few agricultural expeditions. :p Twice I had no brake, and the last time, I was looking at the lap timer, and looked up as I was running out of track. My pads are TOTALLY shot (about the width of a quarter), and I'm gonna need to step up from the Ultimates to a real performance pad, I was smoking the Ultimates within 2 laps. Probably a Hawk HP10 or something. Maybe stainless lines, and I REALLY need a rebuild, the fronts are definitely dragging. Thinking about a 330 upgrade, dunno if I want to drop the cash tho. Gotta flip my tires too, the outsides are totally rounded and lumpy, the insides have a great sidewall/edge and lots of rubber left.








Cliff Notes: Driving fast is AWESOME. The free-eighteen is decent, for an overweight, underpowered beater.

Gayle
08-13-2006, 11:19 PM
I drove my '92 318is for this... bought the car for $2600, it's been a fun project. :)




He pulls up my lap times and starts flipping thru them... best one I pulled was a 2:21.69 or so. I asked him how that compared to the faster cars, and he looked confused. Turns out the best time he ran out there all day was a 2:20.241. :D


Twice I had no brake, and the last time, I was looking at the lap timer, and looked up as I was running out of track. My pads are TOTALLY shot (about the width of a quarter), and I'm gonna need to step up from the Ultimates to a real performance pad, I was smoking the Ultimates within 2 laps. Probably a Hawk HP10 or something. Maybe stainless lines, and I REALLY need a rebuild, the fronts are definitely dragging.




That's awesome! Thanks for the detailed description. I love write ups that make it like you are there.

I thought Crazy Kim was going with you. How did she do given that she really does have an M3 engine?

The brakes sound scary. No pics of the agricultural detours?

TC535i
08-13-2006, 11:29 PM
That's awesome! Thanks for the detailed description. I love write ups that make it like you are there.

I thought Crazy Kim was going with you. How did she do given that she really does have an M3 engine?

The brakes sound scary. No pics of the agricultural detours?

Kim was there in her car. She was a bit nervous at the beginning of the day. I was running her down pretty hard, and she couldn't figure out why her car wasn't pulling hard on me. I had a new coilover suspension, but even with her setup, she should have been giving me more trouble... but I kept coming thru turns and having to back off, carrying more speed than her and coming up on her fast.

She got really rattled, and started wondering what she was doing wrong... and the nervousness just added to the problem. Finally, she checked the tires... when the place had flipped em on the rim last week, they just filled em up with air... and she had forgotten about that rotation and never checked them. They were running about 44-45 psi hot, which is about 5-6 psi more than those tires like. Once she fixed that, she got more confidence in her car, and her laps got quicker. I didn't end up around her on the track later in the day, but she said she was doing much better.


Brakes are toast... I'm glad they made it thru the day, I had to back off there at the end. I need to figure out if I'm upgrading or staying stock size quick, I don't have much time left.


No pics yet, buddy with an SLR came out with us and took some pics, tho I doubt he got any of my off-roading experiences... I'll post some pics up when I get em tho.

Gayle
08-14-2006, 09:01 AM
Kim is such a car babe. You lucked out with her.

When are you going back to buttonwillow?

genphreak
08-14-2006, 10:07 AM
Farout. Reading that makes (even) me want to go racing... :D

Thankz TC535!

Martin in Bellevue
08-14-2006, 11:17 AM
Tim, the puget sound cca classifieds sometines sees e36 m3 brakes. Those guys are very active in upgrades. There's aguy on there now looking for brembo pads for his e36. He may have the stock stuff sitting under a workbench.

http://www.bmwpugetsound.com/vbb/forumdisplay.php?f=10

TC535i
08-14-2006, 01:27 PM
Tim, the puget sound cca classifieds sometines sees e36 m3 brakes. Those guys are very active in upgrades. There's aguy on there now looking for brembo pads for his e36. He may have the stock stuff sitting under a workbench.

http://www.bmwpugetsound.com/vbb/forumdisplay.php?f=10

Thanks Martin... E36 M3 swap is a HUGE pain in the ass tho. Have to change out the front spindle to run those brakes, and the rears are even worse, involving different halfshafts, diff, etc etc. E46 330 bits are a simple caliper/carrier swap... much more desireable, and pretty much the same size as the ///M stuff.

TC535i
08-14-2006, 01:27 PM
Kim is such a car babe. You lucked out with her.

When are you going back to buttonwillow?

Buttonwillow, not sure. Willow Springs may be in 2 weeks or a month, depending on other commitments, funding, etc... we'll see!

TC535i
08-14-2006, 01:28 PM
Farout. Reading that makes (even) me want to go racing... :D

Thankz TC535!

First trackday I ever did was in my E34... :)

Jeff N.
08-14-2006, 01:28 PM
That 318 is a momentum car. Don't hit the brakes and all will be fine.


Thanks Martin... E36 M3 swap is a HUGE pain in the ass tho. Have to change out the front spindle to run those brakes, and the rears are even worse, involving different halfshafts, diff, etc etc. E46 330 bits are a simple caliper/carrier swap... much more desireable, and pretty much the same size as the ///M stuff.

TC535i
08-14-2006, 02:59 PM
That 318 is a momentum car. Don't hit the brakes and all will be fine.

Very true... but with the supercharger, I'm actually able to reach higher speeds in some straights than I can carry thru the following corner! Phenominal, I know... :)

Momentum driving gave me the edge over that Elise. He was pulling away hard on straights, but I could walk away from him by staying in it for some of the combos.

http://buttonwillowraceway.com/images/race_01_config.gif

Once I was able to get back in the throttle after Grapevine, I stayed full throttle all the way up to Lost Hill. Nailing the apexes was imperative, but with the right line, I could just stay on it and track alllllll the way out, and still stay on solid ground. Same goes with the exit of Star Mazda, full throttle thru the esses (driving some berms) and JAM on the brakes right before Sunset and the front straight.

aston_jag_tech
08-16-2006, 09:29 PM
Tim next time youre running let me know, Id like to see the race track atmosphere. I went to a little one, very little at Qualcom stadium a year ago, not to impressive at all but still fun to watch. Very impressive with the track time.

bahnstormer
08-16-2006, 09:48 PM
what tires were u running?

Gayle
08-16-2006, 10:02 PM
Willow Springs (http://www.willowspringsraceway.com/home/home.asp)

Buttonwillow (http://www.buttonwillowraceway.com)

So why do you go to one over the other? And why are all raceways near Bakerfield? Isn't there anything closer? Why do all raceways have "willow" as part of the name? Inquiring minds just want to know.

Jehu
08-16-2006, 10:20 PM
at $4,,700.00 a day its alot cheaper for me to damn the torpedoes and risk a speeding ticket having my fun on some truely open circuit aka public roadway.... see you in Court!

califblue
08-17-2006, 10:18 AM
to answer a few of Gayle's questions:
So why do you go to one over the other? ...variety is the spice of LIFE...BIG WILLOW is the fastest track in the West Period...Just Hold it Open Until you See GOD, then Brake
And why are all raceways near Bakersfield? there use to be a Drag Strip & motocross track in Carlsbad ..land is too desirable in high density areas...The Noise is bugging me...Uh then why did you move next door to the race track?
Isn't there anything closer? see above
Why do all raceways have "willow" as part of the name? It's racer thing
Inquiring minds just want to know. see above

94is
08-17-2006, 02:02 PM
We were both running toyo ra1's.

IMO, Buttonwillow is an extremely technical track. The first time I went out, I nearly rolled my car by going off sideways into the mud. Yay rain! So when I went out on Saturday, I was being very cautious. I got nervous again when once I started driving hard, my car began to slide and not brake well. That is why I was holding Tim up. Once I realized that my tire pressures were out of control, the car handled like it normally does - really well. :D I was hoping that Tim and I would get to run together again, but we never did. It's probably for the best tho, since he went off 3 times later in the day. :p

TC535i
08-31-2006, 07:30 PM
at $4,,700.00 a day its alot cheaper for me to damn the torpedoes and risk a speeding ticket having my fun on some truely open circuit aka public roadway.... see you in Court!
$4,700/day seems a bit steep, considering it only cost me $140... maybe the gate guy really doesn't like you? ;)

TC535i
08-31-2006, 07:35 PM
Just my $.02 on the tracks mentioned...

Streets of Willow is more of a "big autocross". Much tighter turns, it's a handling course, big power only has 2 or 3 spots to shine. My car does pretty well here, considering hp isn't it's strong suit.

Buttonwillow is a TRACK. High speeds, elevation changes, tight turns, off-camber bits... great overall track. This is where a well rounded car will really shine... you need good power, suspension, and brakes to excel here.

Willow Springs (aka Big Willow, aka The Big Track)... billed as the fastest road course in the west. Not very technical at all... lots of gradual, wide sweepers, nothing too tricky. High speeds... Turn 8 is the first time I ever did something in a car my instructor told me to, where I really felt it was the wrong thing to do. He told me to stay in it... I thought I was going too fast. I would have been, if I wasn't in it... but the continued acceleration kept the car pushing thru and it was one of the scariest, most amazing rushes of my life. No time to think... HAMMER the brakes, hit turn 9 just right and slingshot down the front straight!




Different road courses teach you different things. I like Buttonwillow and Streets. Challenging enough that they don't become repeditive... Big Willow was a blast, but there wasn't much else to learn out there at the end of the day.

Gayle
08-31-2006, 09:04 PM
Interesting descriptions Tim. Thanks.