Removing fuel rail hoses, M60

[FiveOJester]

I'm in the process of changing my intake gaskets and PCV valve and have gotten pretty much everything out of the way so I can remove the intake. All I have left are the rubber fuel lines that hook up to the fuel rails. I've tried pushing on them with a large flat head screwdriver with no luck. I really don't want to mess up these hoses so can anyone offer some advice for removing them without damaging them? Like a lot of the various vacuum hoses I had to remove these seem to be fused on from the 10 years of usage making them very reluctant to break loose.

BTW, I'd love to shoot the person that invented the Torx bolt. Removing the seized on upper center throttle body bolt was a PITA. The throttle cable bracket pretty much blocks all access to this bolt except with a very small set of channel locks. Even a small vice grip couldn't be positioned to get a good hold. I finally got around it by removing the outer throttle cable mount bolt and rotating the bracket. I then could fit my tiny channel lock in a good position with a decent area for movement, squeeze it with a larger channel lock and then turn the whole assembly. Took about 4 strokes (about 1/16 of a turn per stroke) to actaully break the thing loose. 2 hours, one stupid Torx bolt that would have been out in 20 seconds had it been a hex head. :( At least it's off. Oh and in case anyone's curious, Home Depot sells the exact bolt needed for replacement with a hex head. 6mm dia x 25 mm long, zinc plated, $0.30/each. :D

[Kalevera]

:) Welcome to V8 ownership. Follow the line back to where it meets the car -- tucked under the eBox on the return, by the heater valve on the send and undo the hose clamps there.

Torx screws are actually able to take more uh...torque...than any hex head. I know, doesn't seem to make much sense, but there are reasons for having them there. Smart of you to buy new ones to replace the stripped out ones; use antisieze when reinstalling (yes, I know -- it's plastic).

The PCV plate can be a bear with those things. I've had to cut them out with an angle grinder -- the plate is being replaced anyway.

best, whit

[FiveOJester]

Heh heh...the more I look around this engine bay the more I wish I had gone for the 535 like I had originally planned. However this 530 was what I wanted (5spd E34), when I needed it, down the street from my work at the right price. Can't complain too much. :D Well when I get around to tightening the steering box that might change...

I got the intake off tonight and have been taking a good look at things. Surprisingly about 2/3s of the Torx bolts came off with the Torx bit! The others stripped but popped right off with the Vice Grips. Guess I'll call it a perk of living in California. :D

Got a few more questions for you whit, or anyone else that can help:

1. I see I've got 4 knock sensors, currently in a position where they can easily be changed. Should I change them? Car has 125k miles on it currently and I'm sure they are original. Did a stomp test about 2 weeks ago and it came up clean. For $50 a pop I'm thinking leave them, however I'd rather not have to remove this intake for a while if they generally last 150k miles.

2. There's a bunch of oil down in the valley below the intake. It looks like it's coming from the tube that runs alongside the driverside head to the PCV valve. Will simply replacing the o-ring at the block end of this tube fix the leak? My PCV came with a new grommet for the other side.

3. The intake has a fair amount of oil in it. Not excessive. The worst of the mess is in the intake runners right around the fuel injectors. Is this normal or is there something to be concerned about? I'm guessing the PCV was simply letting oil past into the intake creating this mess. The actual intake itself was pretty clean inside, just a slight film of oil around the PCV area.

4. Fuel injector seals. I'm in a good position to replace these. Do they start leaking after a while? I did pull a couple of them out a smidgen while trying to figure out how to remove the big black plastic electrical enclosure above the passengerside head.

5. Small Vacuum hoses. I'm going to go ahead and replace all of the small ones running around the intake (the ones without clamps). I was thinking of just picking up a couple of feet from Kragens and cutting to fit. However I've noticed a few of them appear to be pre-formed with BMW part numbers. Are these guys pretty cheap from the dealer or will I be better of just making my own?

6. Hose clamps. A lot of the hose clamps I removed where the "one-way" kind, which can only be removed. Do I need to get special clamps to replace these or will regular old aircraft style worm gear clams work just as well? I'm mostly concerned about the 4 that will be going on the fuel lines.

If there's anything else you can think of that I should be doing while in here feel free to chime in. I'm a big fan of preventative maintenance. Especially if it means not taking off the intake again. :D

Thanks for any help you can offer.

-Dave

[FiveOJester]

Here's some pics I took:

[Kalevera]

Hi Dave.

1) Not unless they're physically damaged. Last time I replaced them....well, let's not get into it...it was an ordeal.

2) Tube is the oil return. That's a fun one to put back in and you might want to find another set of hands to help out with it. Jeff (632 Regal) has written about it a few times -- search on the procedure? Yes, the O ring can be replaced for good measure.

3) That's what intakes do :) If you have access to a parts washer, clean it up a bit. A can of carb cleaner would be a bit messy, but would do the trick. Nothing to be worried about, though.

4) If you want to. I've just oiled them up and stuck em back in previously.

5) Always a good idea. The one preformed hose to watch out on is between the FPR and the PCV plate at the back of the fuel rail/pass side. I've cut a generic piece in the past...just have enough on there so that it won't easily crimp...you know the deal. And make sure it's actually on there when you put it back together. No vacuum to FPR = rough idle, ergo shadetree mechanic who thinks he's messed up on a tedious job.

6) Standard clamps are fine. I hate those BMW tighten-to-break plastic/onetime use clamps.

Be alert while putting it back together. It's really easy to leave something out, and it's a really big pain to take it all apart again.

best, whit

[FiveOJester]

Well I've now got the car mostly put back together. Reinstalling the intake wasn't near as bad as what I had thought from reading around here. The dealer carried the O-ring I needed for $2. I lubed it and the O-ring that came with the PCV valve with motor oil so they would slide easily and not tear during assembly. I then pushed the PCV return pipe all the way forward which gave enough clearance to drop the intake straight in. I then pulled the PCV return pipe up to the PCV valve and attached it. That proved somewhat difficult, the hardest part being attaching the pipe's clip properly to the PCV. Otherwise pretty straightforward.

I've got all the electrical stuff sorted out, I'm now tracking down all the plastic wire clamps that I broke in the process of figuring out what wires needed moving to remove the intake. Unfortunately I broke all 3 clips that hold the oil-level sensor wire and that other wire that disappears underneath the passenger-side headers. Those are a PAIN to reinstall.

I do have a question about the Vacuum system. I went through and replaced all the small vacuum hoses. In the process I neglected to observe which direction the Check Valve (or Non-return valve) was oriented. It's the small black/white valve in the vacuum line that comes off the driverside of the PCV valve. Couldn't seem to find any info here or in Bentley.

Not much left to do so if all goes well tomorrow I should have the beast running!