OT: Originality is Dead

[wingman]

From an article in Classic Car (UK) June 2006.

"A move away from an 'originality is best' mentality is having a dramatic effect on the classic car scene. Owners are refusing to live in the past, upgrading their cars to make them safer, more enjoyable and opting for driving-based events instead of the traditional club gatherings. They care less than ever about originality. The trend has resulted in the MG Owner's Club cancelling their National Meeting for the first time in 30 years..."

1. Is there anything wrong with making a car safer? Why not just buy a safer car?
2. Should a classic car be driven within its limitations and be appreciated for what it is or bastardised to drive like a 2006 model?
3. Will there be any original 'classics' left for our kids?

[Jehu]

Mod it up ,man!

[Zeuk in Oz]

From an article in Classic Car (UK) June 2006.

"A move away from an 'originality is best' mentality is having a dramatic effect on the classic car scene. Owners are refusing to live in the past, upgrading their cars to make them safer, more enjoyable and opting for driving-based events instead of the traditional club gatherings. They care less than ever about originality. The trend has resulted in the MG Owner's Club cancelling their National Meeting for the first time in 30 years..."

1. Is there anything wrong with making a car safer? Why not just buy a safer car?
2. Should a classic car be driven within its limitations and be appreciated for what it is or bastardised to drive like a 2006 model?
3. Will there be any original 'classics' left for our kids?

Interesting concept - I suppose it all started with those new fangled radial tyres !

Safety that matters cannot be retro-fitted as far as I understand. How do you build a safety cell with deformable front and rear into an MG ? How do you add ABS, ESP, air bags and the like ?

I would suggest you buy 3 new Aston Martins or even 3 new Miatas (MX-5 in Oz), drive one and save the others for your kids ! These will presumably be the classic sports cars that will be coveted by school kids in 2046.

Will there still be petrol then ?

My view is keep classic cars stock as much as possible- to do anything else is to bastardise.

ps : can you still buy non-radial (cross ply) tyres ?

[rob101]

"The trend has resulted in the MG Owner's Club cancelling their National Meeting for the first time in 30 years..."

oh boo hoo, MG cars are POS anyway.
seriously though i think its just a sign of changing attitudes in people towards technology. i think its brought about by the information revolution, people want the newest and most advanced cars. Its like iPods and mobile phones, i just realised my mobile phone is little over 4 years old, however you kind of think of it as some kind of relic. people are starting to think like that about cars.
Thing is, that at least in australia the local manufacturers have been very slow to implement things like ABS and ESP across their ranges. they have fixed up their woefully inadequate chassis crashworthiness though which is good but largely the advances in those cars haven't really been that noteable. People believe what they are told is right for the most part because they are too lazy to care (research investigate or whatever) what the truth is. newer car = safer so they ditch that big sedan and get a barina....... safer? well, not really, but ignorance is bliss.

heres another point. if your a crap driver who makes a habit of tailgating trucks or pulling onto median strips of highways. You're going to get screwed up sooner or later, people still get killed driving 4wds and the other "invincibly" safe cars on the road. so perhaps learning how to drive better whilst costing you a decent amount will be cheaper than getting this newer car and still being a moving disaster zone.

PS almost broken the 1000 post threshold. after which point i am going on sabbathical for 3 months

[HDhandyman]

hmmm, well I actually like some of the new "old" cars. I think that the reintroduction of the bug was pretty cool. It had good crash test rating and the contours were all new and classic at the same time. VW is moving towards "suck" a little slower than BMW, but I'll give em credit for that. There are others that are eluding me at the moment.

I also think that despite tough times, etc., Chrysler/ Dodge have done a pretty good job of keeping it original over the last 15 years.--They have rehashed several old ideas from cobra like sports cars, to american station wagons, to old beach wagons, and the new lines are somewhat appealing----though I'd have to say that the visibilty in those cars is absolute shite.

And, while I'm not sure what the trend in OZ has been in the last 20 years, I'm now finding myself reflecting on the fact that we can thank our Euro Big boys (MB, Volvo, Saab, and BMW) for the introduction of "safety first". I remember family members reading a magazine article about the first airbags in a benz at the family table, and I'll bet most here remember how cool "they're boxy, but they're good." was after the movie "Crazy People" came out and Volvo picked up the slogan.

For me, Classic cars means American, as well as Euro. Seems like the great "muscle car" era was almost completely destroyed here by the Japanese quickness toward American marketing for fuel efficiency. Our home grown companies lost that battle and struggled to get back, ever since. Only the staples like the Camaro, Monty Carlo and the Corvette survived.---Now, we hardly even see new versions of those cars on the road here in the last couple of years. What little we have left seems to be carried on in the spirit of Patriotism and American Racing.

BTW, I also think that the smart car is really cool. I can't wait to purchase one here!

[F4Phantom]

oh boo hoo, MG cars are POS anyway.
seriously though i think its just a sign of changing attitudes in people towards technology. i think its brought about by the information revolution, people want the newest and most advanced cars. Its like iPods and mobile phones, i just realised my mobile phone is little over 4 years old, however you kind of think of it as some kind of relic. people are starting to think like that about cars.
Thing is, that at least in australia the local manufacturers have been very slow to implement things like ABS and ESP across their ranges. they have fixed up their woefully inadequate chassis crashworthiness though which is good but largely the advances in those cars haven't really been that noteable. People believe what they are told is right for the most part because they are too lazy to care (research investigate or whatever) what the truth is. newer car = safer so they ditch that big sedan and get a barina....... safer? well, not really, but ignorance is bliss.

heres another point. if your a crap driver who makes a habit of tailgating trucks or pulling onto median strips of highways. You're going to get screwed up sooner or later, people still get killed driving 4wds and the other "invincibly" safe cars on the road. so perhaps learning how to drive better whilst costing you a decent amount will be cheaper than getting this newer car and still being a moving disaster zone.

PS almost broken the 1000 post threshold. after which point i am going on sabbathical for 3 months

I visit a 4x4 forum (my other car) and you would be amazed that all the 4x4 owners think they are safe in a crash. Research shows this is not true apart from very modern 4x4's which handle like a car and have 10 airbags etc.. but these new ones are not good off road (x5 sucks bad) with the exception of the rangie. So a traditional good off road 4x4 is crap in a crash and I would much prefer to be in the BMW. But yes this invincibility thing is a problem I dont understand, I suppose people trust their own judement more than science. I feel that unless you need a 4x4 for one of its few positive qualities, drive a freakin ford falcon wagon!

[Zeuk in Oz]

but these new ones are not good off road (x5 sucks bad)

Except on sand where the X5 is fantastic. Horses for courses.

[Zeuk in Oz]

hmmm, well I actually like some of the new "old" cars. I think that the reintroduction of the bug was pretty cool. It had good crash test rating and the contours were all new and classic at the same time. VW is moving towards "suck" a little slower than BMW, but I'll give em credit for that. There are others that are eluding me at the moment.

Did you ever drive the new bug ?

Absolutely woeful front end - supposed to be like a Golf (Do you still call them Rabbits ?) but its dynamics were terribly inferior.

The new Mini (BMW again) was a different matter and handles nicely.

[GJPinAU]

Did a motorkhana for the MG car club 2 weeks ago.
12 Officials, 7 entrants - started @10 finished by 12.
I was really amazed as MG is probably the biggest club around.

Speaking of classics: VW bugs with WRX engines and I've heard of a full all-wheel drive version. sensational!

[rob101]

The new Mini (BMW again) was a different matter and handles nicely.

I might think about buying one in the future, they are a good car safety wise as well.
I think perhaps the thing I object too the most. Is people foregoing buying an "good" older car (e34 is a good example as is e32) to buy a crap new car such as toyota echo. and then saying "oh look its safer because its new" WRONG! you're dead wrong, my car has ABS and a wheelbase that allows me to manuveure at speed and not loop the car. and a drivers side airbag, and a chassis that is STIFF even 15 years after it was manufactured.
an inferior car that is built now is not better than a good car that was built 10 years ago.
I think with some people i know there is a little bit of a Poseur factor as well. oh look I have a new car aren't I great. Suck it up! that thing has 100 hp and goes 0-100 in 4 hrs and can't go around corners properly and has no spare tyre. how is that better for the same cost (yes we have larger maintenance costs but they get stung with way more depreciation)?